When feminists say teaching pays poorly just because it's female dominated, are their examples cherry-picked an misleading?

Question

Feminists often claim for example that teaching pays less than "equivalent" men's jobs simply because teaching has more women.

High School teachers in the U.S. earn a median income of $55,050, (1) Elementary School teachers $53,090K (2).

Let's look at some male-domoinated professions having the same entry level educational requirement"

Electricans: $49,840. (3)

Carpenters: $39.940 (4)

Plumbers, pipefitters: $49,140 (5)

Hazmat workers: $37.590 (6)

Masons: $44.950 (7)

All these jobs are listed as a High School degree being the normal entry-level educational requirement. Teaching (female dominated) pays the most. It takes place in a climate-controlled environment, has a lower injury rate, gets people home earlier and often affords summers off.

Does teaching really pay less for more work, just because it's female-dominated?


1. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/education-training-and-library/high-school-teachers.htm

2. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/education-training-and-library/kindergarten-and-elementary-school-teachers.htm

3. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/construction-and-extraction/electricians.htm

4. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/construction-and-extraction/carpenters.htm

5. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/construction-and-extraction/plumbers-pipefitters-and-steamfitters.htm

6. http://www.bls.gov/ooh/construction-and-extraction/hazardous-materials-removal-workers.htm
http://www.bls.gov/ooh/construction-and-extraction/brickmasons-blockmasons-and-stonemasons.htm7.

Answer 1

"When feminists say teaching pays poorly just because it's female dominated, are their examples cherry-picked an misleading?"



Yes, feminists are famous for cherry picking, or any similar action that will "prove" their assertion no matter how off-base or unnatural. Your sources are much appreciated in this regard. But the whole premise of "women's" and "men's jobs" is a little bit of a red herring in the whole gender debate arena to be quite honest.



Feminist MUST answer some reasonable questions if they are going to make assertions out of the blue. And in this case .... If businesses could pay less in wages simply be decreeing a job to be a "female job", or by simply hiring a majority or all female employees, then why wouldn't EVERY sinlge job become a "female job"? This would become a standard business practice because the directors and shareholders would DEMAND that lower paid workers be hired for the simple fact that profits would increase resulting in higher share prices and dividends each quarter.



This is the same as the crazy, unfounded assertion that companies are paying less money to women at the same workplace. Basically feminists are stating that legitimate companies are wilfully breaking the law (Equal Pay Act of 1963) on a daily basis, to pay women less money. IF this was actually happening, then why wouldn't they hire ALL female employees and make a larger profit? What business cares about men so much that they would spend more money in wages contrary to all known business practices?



The latest red-herring argument is that women are still paid less due to privacy policies surrounding employee pay. But if this was truly the case, then why would employers stop discriminating at women only? They could discriminate against almost everyone and really save a lot of money in wages. Of course, employers are accountable to the dept of Labour and the IRS for disclosing all their paid out salaries and wages, so this whole concept is just another non-issue. More feminists just clutching at straws and trying to save their coveted, but rapidly discredited "gender wage gap" theory.

Answer 2

I think the fact that teaching is a female dominated area is one reason that pay for teachers is so low, but honestly, I think the USA has gotten some very mixed up priorities when it comes to the whole education sector.



I should probably start by saying that I'm an Australian teacher, and I often travel and teach in other countries (so far all in Asia). As such, I'm in an excellent position to compare Western standards to Asian when it comes to education.



First of all, most countries (including the USA) require teachers to have a university degree. So your comparisons to things like plumbers and electricians are not relevant.



I've also seen a lot of people's answers on here referring to teaching being a cushie job, and you either have really crap teachers or you just have no idea of the work that's involved. Yes, teaching is officially a 40hr a week job. But you add onto that all the planning involved, the marking and the resource production and it's a massive job. At my last school, over the five different classes I taught I had well over 250 students. Until you've had to mark over 250 1000 word essays in less then a week YOU HAVE NOT KNOWN PAIN! Ok, I might be a little dramatic with that. But you get where I'm coming from. It's not unusual for me to still be up at 2am marking papers when I have to wake up at 6:30am to get ready for school.



The low payrates for teachers in America isn't just hurting women, it's hurting your entire country because when I look at places I want to teach; America is at the bottom of the list. From all reports, teachers in America get no respect whatsoever. They're seen as lazy and unqualified, and so no one cares when people hear that they don't get paid much. But as a result, a lot of smart motivated people do NOT want to go into teaching there. And as a result of that, you end up getting a lot of teachers who really are lazy and unqualified because it was an easy job avenue.



In some countries in Europe, it takes 8 years to do a teaching degree. In Japan teachers are given regular tests like the SATs in order to make sure that all teachers are up to standard. These countries want quality teachers in their schools and the teachers are paid accordingly. Their educational standards are miles above the USAs, all because America is not valuing it's educational system. You need to pay what something's worth. If you want good teachers, you need to pay for good teachers!



So in answer to your question again, yes. I think that the reason teachers don't get paid enough in the USA probably is at least in part attributed to it being a female dominated profession. People think it's easy, that anyone can do it. And as a result, anyone DOES do it. But you don't want just anyone being a teacher. You want the people that genuinely want to be teachers and will put the work in.



Bad pay for teachers doesn't just lower the pay average of women. It lowers the educational standards of the entire country and will result in the USA slowly falling behind the rest of the world.

Answer 3

I apologize to any teachers I offend with this.



Teachers do not deserve higher pay. They have one of the cushiest jobs in existence. teachers get more days off than they get on, and barely ever work a 40 hour week. I've had teachers who taught with a PowerPoint every class and just sat at their desk looking at porn or whatever the Heck the were doing.



although the male professions you listed do not require a four year degree.... I get the impression you didn't look at your own sources. seems to be a common trend amongst MRAs.

Answer 4

Teaching has always been a lower paying job in comparison to education required to be one. They only work part time! I know, my parents were teachers. Combined they had almost ten years of college too. It's crazy..but true. At work by 8am home by 3:30..summers off, all holidays, two weeks at Christmas? Who does that in real working world?

Answer 5

??? You are under the delusion that teachers have ONLY a high school diploma, WHY, exactly?



They have college degrees, and training and student-teaching on top of that; and they are expected to continue their education, during their careers.



BTW, I've never said teachers are underpaid because most are women.



Gets them HOME earlier? Well, yes, but with stacks of papers to grade, and future lessons to plan. Not to mention that most teachers have to buy supplies for their underfunded classrooms.



They spend summers planning, and on continued education; sometimes working to supplement their incomes.



Where you got the idea teachers have only high school diplomas is unclear. That's completely absurd.

Answer 6

Of course feminists cherry pick and give misleading examples. If women truly thought a job paying 55k was in all ways equivalent to a job paying 35k, they would pick the better paying job every time. Feminists just ignore real differences between jobs pretending different work is the same.

Answer 7

In the East(Asian countries) teachers are paid handsomely and highly valued and respected. In the West its the complete opposite. China's school system is literally training their children to take over the world economically and I don't blame them. I would do the same if I had kids. Also children in China respect teachers. Children in America do not.



Also: To all American parents that my harsh words apply to. Its not teachers responsibility to raise and discipline your fuucked up misbehaving kids. That's your job as a parent.



I think male and female teachers in the West should be paid at least $30,000 more per year.

Answer 8

I'm not sure I would disagree that a factor in the lower pay of a teacher is because most of them are women. Now it's only one factor, but it's not because of a widespread conspiracy to keep women down. It's because women are notorious for being terrible at negotiating wages. In fact it's my contention that women in the workforce have stymied all of our pay.

Answer 9

Teachers are university graduates. You need to compare like to like. I don't think they are underpaid and with those long holidays, why should they complain? Where is the link?

Answer 10

Teachers deserve a higher pay than a plumber.

Answer 11

This is BS because the trades do not require half the education teachers do.